Using bad math to snark about teacher's salaries.

Recently a friend (and a teacher) of mine posted a link to this note on Fbook (warning this and/or my following comments my tick you off. Read at your own peril.

HIGHLY PAID TEACHERS

Are you sick of highly paid teachers? Teachers' hefty salaries are driving up taxes, and they only work 9 or 10 months a year! It's time we put things in perspective and pay them for what they do - baby sit! We can get that for less than minimum wage. 
That's right. Let's give them $3.00 an hour and only the hours they worked; not any of that silly planning time, or any time they spend before or after school. That would be $19.50 a day (7:45 to 3:00 PM with 45 min. off for lunch and plan -- that equals 6 1/2 hours). Each parent should pay $19.50 a day for these teachers to baby-sit their children. 

Now how many students do they teach in a day...maybe 30? So that's $19.50 x 30 = $585.00 a day. However, remember they only work 180 days a year!!! I am not going to pay them for any vacations. LET'S SEE.... That's $585 X 180 = $105,300 per year. (Hold on! My calculator needs new batteries). 

What about those special education teachers and the ones with Master's degrees? Well, we could pay them minimum wage ($7.75), and just to be fair, round it off to $8.00 an hour. That would be $8 X 6 1/2 hours X 30 children X 180 days = $280,800 per year. 

Wait a minute -- there's something wrong here! 
There sure is! 
The average teacher's salary (nation wide) is $50,000. $50,000/180 days = $277.77/per day/30 students = $9.25/6.5 hours = $1.42 per hour per student--a very inexpensive baby-sitter and they even EDUCATE your kids!) WHAT A DEAL!!!! 


I call BULLSH*T!!!   I have to say I'm pretty irritated with this.  Teacher salaries, pensions, and benefits are important, yes, but they should not be misrepresented. I'm tired of EVERYONE who whines about what they make. They chose the profession and knew the go ingrate. If you didn't you're too dumb to be a teacher. Seriously.


Here is my 1st response:
"It is a valid point, BUT not all teachers are worth even that. (had some pretty bad ones in my time and with my kids) 
And the problem isn't with the teachers it's with the bureaucrats who choose the curricula and the standards. Sorry but I HATE they way our elementary schools are teaching many of the subjects. And I HATE the "participation" trophy ideal that they are shoving down our kids throats. Not to mention teaching global warming as fact (it's still a theory, just like evolution, or any other creation explanation) and turning all our kids into little recycling czars who poo poo their parents for driving mini-vans not hybrids. blech!
I don't take issue with the rate of pay teachers get, I take issue with the free or nearly free pensions, the unionized "guaranteed by law" pay raises, and the benefits that last till they die. VERY few other industries give pensions anymore because they have realized how cost prohibitive it is and they are a major reason states like California and Illinois will probably be bankrupt in 2 years if not sooner."

OP (original poster)'s reply:

"Nichol, I definitely respect your opinion but I am sticking to my huge agreement with the link! I can not think of another profession that requires a master's degree, a year of unpaid internship (student teaching), and then expects a person to work 60+ hours per week for such little pay."

My 2nd response:

"How about the entry level business management positions where you have to intern in college after your mba and get a salaried job for under 40K and work 80+ hour a week? (real life example of a friend of mine back east)

Or how about my job?? I don't get paid ANYTHING!!! Sorry. Salaried means you don't make minimum hourly wage. That's the definition of salary. It also means it's a guaranteed wage. Something that hourly people usually can't count on unless they have a contract which very few do.
Teachers don't have it that bad. Oh and let's not forget that it is their choice to be one. No one is forcing you to do it. You could have been anything you wanted when you choice your career.
I know I may sound like a callous bitch, but I'm really tired of people whining about "the lot their given" when they've chosen much of what they are experiencing."

Friend of OP's comment:

"On top of the masters degree and unpaid internship, wr also have to continue to pay out of our pocket for graduate level courses to maintain our license. Does an MBA have to fork over another 10k for tuition and books within 3 years of graduating while still paying on their student loans so they can keep their job?"

My last reply:

"So do RNs, ask my mom. And she makes about the same as most teachers (less than 50K though) and she has to pay out of pocket for her CEUs....Like I said before YOU CHOSE this knowing what the pay scale is.

I do think that there should be more of "clinical" type structure for teachers to go from students to certified. More like RNs do. No one should have to work for free, unless they really want to. (i.e. volunteering out of compassion not force)

Don't get me wrong I value what you do. I appreciate all the work that the teachers my children have had have put in. I really do. And everyone wants to get paid more, but I'm tired of hearing that the answer to our educational system's problems are that teachers need to be paid more. And salaried jobs are sucky like that. Marc was salaried (my husband) at far less than the average teacher makes and put in 60-70 hours a week. Much of which was traveling far away from his family.

Also the math is skewed. Daycare center workers DO NOT get paid per kid. They get paid HOURLY. If we are paying teachers just for the job of babysitting then we should only pay them for their contact hours. At 175 days for the 2010-11 school year in Beaverton and 8 hours a day with a PAID lunch that's 1400 hours for the year. At $7.75 per HOUR (not per kid) That comes to $10,850 a year. Far less than the average teacher makes. For s&gs let's add in another 10 hours a week for prep time and for all those pesky grading days. 250 hours comes to another $1937.50 for a grand total of $12,787.50
Let's look at the average in home daycare next. Most get paid per kid, per week (not hourly) at about $1-200 per week. Average around $125 per week, with having to provide lunches and snacks, their own toys, books, supplies for crafts etc. If they have 4-5 kids (usually the limit for state certification for the average home) then they will make about $75 per week per kid after food for a total of about $375 per week. At the same number of contact hours for a teacher of 25 weeks that comes to about $9,375 a year.

So sure I'll pay you minimum wage. It will save me a ton on my taxes."

So my final opinion (yes it is an opinion and you can agree to disagree, this is MY blog after all) is that teachers get paid plenty, that it isn't the amount they are paid that is the problem with our schools, it is lack of parental involvement, bad curriculum choices, energy spent on BS topics (like global warming), bureaucratic waste, useless testing, and union bullying of states that are the real issues with the US educational system. Unfunded pensions are bankrupting our states and our children aren't doing any better than they were before No Child Left Behind (dumbest legislation ever). 

School choice (vouchers), more parental involvement (incentivized if necessary), and back to basic curricula could help.  Oh and how about NOT throwing away perfectly good school supplies???

Update to the Red Robin Breastfeeding Discrimination Story-This is GOOD!!

After many emailed, tweeted, Facebooked, and phoned Red Robin our efforts it seems have paid off! I'm so proud of what a community can do when we stand behind what is right.

Update 06/24/2010: I got a call from Liz at corporate at 10:00am today. It was a very positive phone call! Here's the conversation that took place:

Liz: First off, is now a good time to talk? I know you're a mom and really busy.

Me: Yeah, now is good, my littlest is asleep and the older one is watching TV with his uncle.

Liz: Okay. We are so sorry about what happened the other day. There's a lot of information about what happened and I wanted to hear it from you. Is that okay?

Me: Yes, that's just fine. Tuesday night I went on a date with my husband. We had my daughter with me and she got hungry so I started to feed her. At first I was pulling my shirt up but since we were at a booth it was really awkward and I was really exposed. Being in that position made my shirt be in my armpits. So I decided to bring my breast over my neckline and nurse that way. Then the manager came up to us and said somebody had complained and asked us to cover up. I said no and my husband informed the manager that it was my legal right to nurse wherever I wanted. The manager said he understood that but this was a family restaurant and he had a shirt I could use to cover up. I said we would just leave.

Yesterday I posted about my experience on Facebook and started talking to my friends about it. One of my friends found out the law in Washington is that managers, business owners, or employees cannot ask a woman to leave, stop breastfeeding, or cover up. I knew that my right to breastfeed was protected but I thought that a manager could ask you to leave. Once I learned the full extent of the law I contacted Red Robin's Guest Services about it. I got a call from Guest Services telling me they would have the Regional Director call me. 

She did call me, and I'm sorry, but I don't remember her name. She told me she was sorry, and that she was going to talk to the manager who had talked to me, and that they were sending me a gift card. However, she also said that it's not really the job of the managers to learn the laws. She also didn't give me any assurance it wouldn't happen again. She said that the managers are supposed to make the majority happy, so if a lot of people complain about a breastfeeding that the manager would probably talk to the breastfeeding mom about covering up. I feel that's not good enough. So, yeah, that's what's been going on.

Liz: Well, I again wanted to say how sorry I am that this happened. I'm a mom who has breastfed and I know how important it is. Moms who are breastfeeding should be able to feed their babies wherever they need to. The manager was in the wrong and we are going to instigate a company wide training to teach about what to do when customers complain about breastfeeding.

Me: I think that sounds like a great idea, that would be wonderful.

Liz: We have training for our managers already to train them on local laws and such, we contract with an independent third party to do our training. We will be sure to make an emphasis on breastfeeding training. We'll start immediately at the Kennewick Red Robin, but I want to let you know it's going to take a little bit of time to implement it nationwide.

Me: I understand, it's a big company. I'm glad you're implementing this.

Liz: Now, I want to make it very clear that I'm not making excuses, but it's a very sticky situation for our managers to deal with. It's hard to make everyone happy. Do you have any ideas on how to help?

Me: Yes, I do. First of all, there is a website for Washington breastfeeding laws that offers little cards you can print out. Mothers can use them to inform others about their rights and managers can give them to customers who complain to explain the laws. That way your managers can say, "I'm sorry, but it's the law," without the customer getting mad at the restaurant.

Liz: That's a great idea!

Me: They also have fliers you can print up and display in a prominent place of your restaurant informing customers of the law. Also, I know that breastfeeding laws are different everywhere. In Washington mother's rights are protected but in Idaho I know managers can ask you to leave. It would be really nice if Red Robin was a breastfeeding friendly restaurant everywhere, regardless of the laws.

Liz: That would be good. Do you have the website for those cards? That's a great idea.

Me: I don't know it off the top of my head, but I can email it to you. Do you want me to send it to guest relations or do you have a specific address you want me to use?

Liz: You can use guest relations, but here's my email address, it's really easy. [Email address]. If you have any ideas you can send them here, we want to hear them and we want to have an open dialouge.

Me: I can't think of anything else right now, but I'll ask my friends if they have any ideas. I wanted to say that I really appreciate this phone call, thank you for doing all this.

Liz: My pleasure, we just want everyone to be happy. 

****

So overall I'm really happy with how Red Robin is handling this now. I don't think I'll organize an official nurse-in but I think it would be a good idea for mothers to go to Red Robin and nurse. Also, let them know how you feel about how you want them to uphold a mother's right to breastfeed, whether it's state law or not.

If they don't do what they say they're going to then we can take this further. But as of right now I'm feeling pretty happy.

Now please go back to the Red Robin Comment form and tell them how happy you are with their response! 

Here's mine:


I am writing you again in response to the breastfeeding discrimination incident at your Kennewick, Washtington location on 6/22

I wanted to let you know that I am thrilled with your corporate manager Liz's response to my friend Krista. Her sensitivity and understanding of the law was the kind of customer service I like to see in places I frequent.

I am very pleased to hear that Red Robin will be redoubling their efforts to make sure managers are trained in the local laws that protect a woman's right to breastfeed in their restaurants.

I would encourage you to go one step further and make Red Robin a breastfeeding friendly business, by supporting the right of moms and babies. If you decide to adopt company wide policies that are mom and baby friendly please publicize it! We would love to know. And I will make sure to share your support of breastfeeding with my blog and Twitter followers as widely as I did my criticism of this incident.

My family's tradition of celebrating the children's birthdays at your restaurant is still up in the air until I see how all of this pans out.  I hope that you are true to your word and work to make Red Robin and true "family restaurant"

Sincerely,
Nichol Miller

From breastfeeding rights to birth choice and safety

They are all feminist issues!! Bodily autonomy and the right to how we use our bodies, respond to them, and allow them to work is a human right.

Some states get this when it comes to breastfeeding like I mentioned in my last post about Washington state's breastfeeding law, but NO WHERE do they seem get it when it comes to birth.  And by they I mean the laws protecting a woman's right to choose, not only IF she has her child, but where, when, how, and with whom she can birth her baby.

How doctors like this or this are allowed anywhere near birthing mothers in our country is beyond me. When we have one of the highest maternal death rates in the industrialized world, a cesarean rate that is twice the WHO recommended value, and more babies born premature due to interventions than could possibly be safe why aren't the powers that be doing something about it?  Instead we are allowing doctors to dictate to women how they will give birth using documents like this!

Famed midwife Ina May Gaskin whose birth center The Farm in Tennessee has a cesarean rate of under 5% has been working hard to bring to light the dangers in modern obstetrics and how in the United States we seem to be blissfully unaware of the unreasonably high death rates of moms and babies. Her projected called The Safe Mother's Quilt was started to bring to light the severity of the situation.  By raising awareness of this hidden risk to our nations women and children she hopes to see changes made in policy and procedures governing the management of birth in our nations hospitals. Take a look at the fact sheet she has put together. So much of this report is not readily known by women going into hospitals to have their babies. But it should be.

With the recent release of the Amnesty International report on the crisis in maternal health care here in the US, those of us in the natural birth circles are hoping more prominent and influential people will step up and make changes. But when the attitudes of OB/Gyns continues to be one of disdain and disregard women who wish to birth in a hospital will continue to face the risks of unnecessary interventions, over managed medical responses to labor, and even unnecessary high risk surgery.

This article in the NY Times did a really good job outlining some of the risks and causes of our higher rates.

Someone once said that a good way to judge how an OB will treat a woman in labor is to ask them what they think about doulas.  I recommend that if you are expecting, plan to deliver with an OB, in a hospital or attached birth center asking them how they feel about birth plans, doulas, and informed consent.

***I just want to say that there are certainly cases where interventions and cesareans are 100% medically necessary.  But the World Health Organization says that 15% is the rate that should not be crossed for cesarean deliveries.  That rate gives the best outcomes of both maternal and infant survivability. Currently in the US we are at an average of 32%. Some places are double that.***